A Text Book Example of Toxic Hyper Masculinity

By OckyDub | Posted Jul 13 2016 | 36 Comments  

@Binswanson

In the world of mainstream media, blogs, vlogs, websites and social media; phrases or terms like toxic masculinity, hyper-masculinity, #MasculinitySoFragile, misogyny, sexism and homophobia are in my opinion often misused for the silliest of situations. Not in this case pertaining to the disturbing video below.

It has been scientifically proven that those who identify as heterosexual, who aggressively outwardly express anti-homosexual attitudes are usually attempting to hide and deflect their own bisexual or homosexual tendencies. I’m not saying this is the case here but it is very possible.

The disturbed individual who pointed his gun at the African American man exiting the store, who he referred to as a “dick in the booty ass nigga”,  goes by the  Twitter handle @Binswanson and his Facebook page is Flex Swan Finesse. His Twitter account under this handle has now been made private but not before the video uploaded went viral. 

He not only had to prove to those in the car with him how intact his masculinity is by speaking and displaying his disdain for homosexuals; he also was compelled to record the criminal act and share it with his 2000 plus followers and the world via social media. Once it went viral, he replied to the understandable outrage by stating, All the gay people mad. “I don’t give a fuck about none of that shit y’all saying I hate gay niggas save that shit.” He also went on to say in a Periscope video that he would have shot the man who was wearing the “tight” pants.

What you witnessed was masculine fragility. Even though the sexuality of the man who had the gun pulled on him is not known, this was gay bashing. This was bullying. This was menacing. Also on a small scale, this was terrorism.

idiot @Binswanson

The Detroit police department is actively investigating this incident so of course this hoodlum idiot is going to be arrested and possibly jailed. He possibly could even be prosecuted under Federal Hate Crime laws. Unfortunately this will add another Black body to the US prison industrial institutional system.

I could make this about homophobia in the Black community perpetrated by Black men but I don’t feel like reading a bunch of “white people do it too” comments, so I’ll finish with just two points.

First; why is it that gay-bashers cowardly hunt in packs? If you view non-heterosexuals as weaker than or easy targets, why not single handily commence the attack? Why is a group typically needed to harass, violate, physically attack and kill a homosexual? Shouldn’t a anti-homosexual masculine man be able to attack a homosexual without weapons, tricks, or sneak attacks on his own? Isn’t that a better way to show stronger hyper-masculine prowess?

Secondly, (and I know this is offensive to most) at what point can it be universally acknowledged that anti-non-heterosexual attitudes and resentments are rooted in religion? Anti-homosexual beliefs are taught and passed down from generation to generation. Even passive tolerance is just as much damaging. “Hate the sin (homosexuality), love the sinner” or “I’m against discrimination but I’m also against the Gay Lifestyle”, is still oppressive and dangerous. By the way, what the fuck is the “gay lifestyle”?

These attitudes and ideologies heard by the minds of non-heterosexuals at an early age can lead to psychological dysfunctions, depression, suicide, STI transmissions, substance abuse, self-hate and deceptions from being in the closet.

Worse, these attitudes continue to influence and contribute to violence inflicted upon homosexuals and transgenders such as the case with the massacre at the Pusle night club in Orlando, FL.

I’ve had a gun pulled on me during a carjacking, it’s surreal and terrifying. To the Black man in the video who had the gun pulled on him… stay strong brotha.   

*** *** ***

Detroit police are asking the victim or if you know the person with the gun to call 313-596-2200. Click Man points gun at person in suspected gay hate crime Twitter video to see the news report video of the story.

 

 

 

 

About the Author
OckyDub

Octavius is a founder and editor of Cypher Avenue. He's here to help speak for us and show the world that masculine gay / bisexual men of color are not a part of the stereotypical gay normal that is seen and fed to the masses. No...we are a distinct breed, filled with character and pride. Cypher Avenue is here to show the world how we are different.

   
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36 Comments Feel Free To Join The Cypher.

  1. JNH412
    JNH412 | July 14th, 2016
    0

    This was some disgusting sh*t…

    To be really real, it is time as a group of "masculine" brothas to acknowledge that muh f*ckas is on to something with this toxic masculinity stuff.

    Getting G-checked in the hood is part of everyday life for ppl that's in the hood I just recently had to restrain myself from beatin on this lil 5 foot nothin dude at this liquor store in Flint. All I did was get out the car and ol dude started yelling"Beat a Nikka ass in some flip flops" multiple times… I was obviously the only Nikka with some Jordan flip flops on, it was aslo obvious that this dude was suffering from the toxicity of a hyper-masculinized projection. Check another Nikka on his manhood in order to reaffirm your own… Which is a masculinized endeavor. Homie thought cuz he was with a bunch of his boys that they would back him if I wanted to make to beef legit… I ended up peacing up all the Nikkas he was with because I was in my hood and they all been knowing me since I was a lil Nikka except for him. They started saying "Don't mind him" because they all know what could've happened.

    I done had shotguns and glocks pulled on me, done had Nikkas say I wasn't a real man/strong man cuz I didn't perfectly meet the parameters of one in their opinion. None of this is new and it happens on both the macro/extreme level such as this filmed example and even on micro/banal interactions.

    I'm just waiting on a time when I can be a man and not have to beat somebody ass to prove it.

  2. OckyDub
    Ockydub | July 14th, 2016
    0
    JNH412

    This was some disgusting sh*t…

    To be really real, it is time as a group of "masculine" brothas to acknowledge that muh f*ckas is on to something with this toxic masculinity stuff.

    Getting G-checked in the hood is part of everyday life for ppl that's in the hood I just recently had to restrain myself from beatin on this lil 5 foot nothin dude at this liquor store in Flint. All I did was get out the car and ol dude started yelling"Beat a Nikka ass in some flip flops" multiple times… I was obviously the only Nikka with some Jordan flip flops on, it was aslo obvious that this dude was suffering from the toxicity of a hyper-masculinized projection. Check another Nikka on his manhood in order to reaffirm your own… Which is a masculinized endeavor. Homie thought cuz he was with a bunch of his boys that they would back him if I wanted to make to beef legit… I ended up peacing up all the Nikkas he was with because I was in my hood and they all been knowing me since I was a lil Nikka except for him. They started saying "Don't mind him" because they all know what could've happened.

    I done had shotguns and glocks pulled on me, done had Nikkas say I wasn't a real man/strong man cuz I didn't perfectly meet the parameters of one in their opinion. None of this is new and it happens on both the macro/extreme level such as this filmed example and even on micro/banal interactions.

    I'm just waiting on a time when I can be a man and not have to beat somebody ass to prove it.

    100dap
    THANK YOU for sharing this.

  3. JNH412
    JNH412 | July 14th, 2016
    0

    No doubt Ock, thanks for starting this convo.

    I get that there are some incendiary attacks levied against men who have masculine personalities, myself included… and it can make it very difficult to actually have this kind of convo to parse out what is toxic masculinity as opposed to just masculinity. I like that there is some cross talk to help compartmentalize these behaviors. I dont think anybody deserves to be attacked for being femme or for being masc. We're all in the same bull together. We all are trying to discover and live in our true identities… A lot of times masculine dudes just get misread… tho heavily desired… and a lot of times masculine dudes are performing a kind of misguided iteration of masculinity which has been the fuel to start wars and obliterated anything that's deemed as weak/weakening.

    I've grown up in Flint, MI my whole life… I learned how to and how to not be a man in Flint…. Which pretty much means I learned how to be a n*gga. My performance as a n*gga gets me a lot of flack from women and femme performing people as I represent what mostly resembles the patriarchy to them, even when I approach with the best intentions. That can be tiring and exhausting and can lead to more attacks on the other side. We don't need that either.

    I really applaud and appreciate the criticality with which these posts address this complication of masculinity vs hyper/toxic masculinity. Looking forward to more discussions like this. Hate that my mans with the pop had to be centered in the crosshairs like that. smh…

    We have a much greater enemy to contend with.

  4. JNH412
    JNH412 | July 14th, 2016
    0

    Btw… I'm dead that this n*gga really holdin a pistol while trying to stabilize himself on that walker… lmfao… That's some Detroit sh*t 4real!!!! Homie really got a point to prove… smh… Sit yo ol broke leg ass down!! And he from Plymouth?!?! Aint no real bangers ever been from Plymouth… smh… Mofo's flexing for Facebook…

  5. OckyDub
    Ockydub | July 14th, 2016
    0
    JNH412

    Btw… I'm dead that this n*gga really holdin a pistol while trying to stabilize himself on that walker… lmfao… That's some Detroit sh*t 4real!!!! Homie really got a point to prove… smh… Sit yo ol broke leg ass down!! And he from Plymouth?!?! Aint no real bangers ever been from Plymouth… smh… Mofo's flexing for Facebook…

    The bubble bath pic got me.

  6. Rico
    Rico | July 14th, 2016
    0
    JNH412

    No doubt Ock, thanks for starting this convo.

    I get that there are some incendiary attacks levied against men who have masculine personalities, myself included… and it can make it very difficult to actually have this kind of convo to parse out what is toxic masculinity as opposed to just masculinity. I like that there is some cross talk to help compartmentalize these behaviors. I dont think anybody deserves to be attacked for being femme or for being masc. We're all in the same bull together. We all are trying to discover and live in our true identities… A lot of times masculine dudes just get misread… tho heavily desired… and a lot of times masculine dudes are performing a kind of misguided iteration of masculinity which has been the fuel to start wars and obliterated anything that's deemed as weak/weakening.

    I've grown up in Flint, MI my whole life… I learned how to and how to not be a man in Flint…. Which pretty much means I learned how to be a n*gga. My performance as a n*gga gets me a lot of flack from women and femme performing people as I represent what mostly resembles the patriarchy to them, even when I approach with the best intentions. That can be tiring and exhausting and can lead to more attacks on the other side. We don't need that either.

    I really applaud and appreciate the criticality with which these posts address this complication of masculinity vs hyper/toxic masculinity. Looking forward to more discussions like this. Hate that my mans with the pop had to be centered in the crosshairs like that. smh…

    We have a much greater enemy to contend with.

    I applaud YOU for intelligently navigating and understanding your circumstances. Living in Chicago I see young gay/bi black men, fem or masc, escape from the South and West sides of town from homophobia and hyper-masculinity-mixed-with-guns, to the North (re: white gay) side of town. Though they run into a race-class wall from the landed-gentry gay community, they at least have small options to "disappear" in a large city like mine, New York, LA, etc. Then there's all the men like you in cities like Flint, and rusted out states like Michigan, who don't have many "escape" options and have to "stand their ground," dealing with their environment as it is and as you've done.

    On one hand, it made me think this is why we have to push and fight so hard to keep what FEDERAL protections we've gained under President Obama, and need Federal solutions for opportunity as local and state governments can't be relied on or trusted to protect and nurture the human rights and potential of those in places like Flint. The abused need a nationwide-shield so that they have safe harbors wherever they go.

    And sadly, it'll get worse before getting better. As the promised opportunities and jobs from both political candidates for president don't get fulfilled, we can expect those with no sense, education or hope, like this fool and his Facebook bravado, to be just another one of the impoverished beating up on the other impoverished, doing white supremacy's dirty work of suppression for itself. And we can't have a talk about TOXIC masculinity if we aren't going to or are unwilling to discuss black masculinity in general, both in the black communities and in Amerca at large.

  7. JNH412
    JNH412 | July 14th, 2016
    0
    Rico

    I applaud YOU for intelligently navigating and understanding your circumstances. Living in Chicago I see young gay/bi black men, fem or masc, escape from the South and West sides of town from homophobia and hyper-masculinity-mixed-with-guns, to the North (re: white gay) side of town. Though they run into a race-class wall from the landed-gentry gay community, they at least have small options to "disappear" in a large city like mine, New York, LA, etc. Then there's all the men like you in cities like Flint, and rusted out states like Michigan, who don't have many "escape" options and have to "stand their ground," dealing with their environment as it is and as you've done.

    On one hand, it made me think this is why we have to push and fight so hard to keep what FEDERAL protections we've gained under President Obama, and need Federal solutions for opportunity as local and state governments can't be relied on or trusted to protect and nurture the human rights and potential of those in places like Flint. The abused need a nationwide-shield so that they have safe harbors wherever they go.

    And sadly, it'll get worse before getting better. As the promised opportunities and jobs from both political candidates for president don't get fulfilled, we can expect those with no sense, education or hope, like this fool and his Facebook bravado, to be just another one of the impoverished beating up on the other impoverished, doing white supremacy's dirty work of suppression for itself. And we can't have a talk about TOXIC masculinity if we aren't going to or are unwilling to discuss black masculinity in general, both in the black communities and in Amerca at large.

    Thank you very much for this post man! …. You just said all this sh*t!!! Everything u just identified is pretty much what I'm thinking through while writing this dissertation… U tryna help edit?!? lbvs… haha…

  8. JNH412
    JNH412 | July 14th, 2016
    0
    Ockydub

    The bubble bath pic got me.

    BRUUUUHHHHH!!!! LMFAO…. Since when do gang bangers take bubble baths?!?!? And got the Gucci Guilty sitting next to the burner… And he pullin up on dudes talking bout d*ck in the booty?!?!? I cant even… I wont even… smh…

  9. OckyDub
    Ockydub | July 14th, 2016
    0
    JNH412

    BRUUUUHHHHH!!!! LMFAO…. Since when do gang bangers take bubble baths?!?!? And got the Gucci Guilty sitting next to the burner… And he pullin up on dudes talking bout d*ck in the booty?!?!? I cant even… I wont even… smh…

    He was tying to be like….

    [​IMG]

  10. Aejae
    Aejae | July 14th, 2016
    0

    Oh yeah. He’s trade indeed.

  11. Nick Delmacy
    Nick Delmacy | July 14th, 2016
    0
    Ockydub

    [​IMG]

    But how can that be?! Dudes on our site keep saying that Black People aren't Homophobic!!!
    :ravetho::troll:

  12. OckyDub
    Ockydub | July 14th, 2016
    0
    Nick Delmacy

    But how can that be?! Dudes on our site keep saying that Black People aren't Homophobic!!!

    Really dude? LOL you just gonna copy and paste replies huh?

  13. Nick Delmacy
    Nick Delmacy | July 14th, 2016
    0
    Ockydub

    Really dude? LOL you just gonna copy and paste replies huh?

    It applied to both posts…

  14. OhSheit
    OhSheit | July 15th, 2016
    0

    I saw this when it was first posted. Sorry but the comment section was funny as shyt and people went hard too. Twitter is what reported him, even exposed all his hangout stops and home. Just went in!

  15. JohnDoe
    JohnDoe | July 16th, 2016
    0

    I'm not masculine but from my limited experience masculinity shouldn't be forced. If you're trying, you're not.

  16. SwagJack
    SwagJack | July 16th, 2016
    0

    To answer your first point, they oppress in packs because they don’t know if the dude they’re about to bash is – like my older cuz – good with them hands or has a weapon.

  17. elg | July 17th, 2016
    0

    Good article Ocky. I think the incident depicted in the above video shows very clearly what happens to clockable and/or openly gay black men on a daily/regular basis in typical black or predominately black areas (wastelands) otherwise known as “the hood”.

    The only black gay/bisexual men who are “safe” in typical black or mostly black areas are those who are closeted and can pass for straight or those who are on the down-low. All others (those black gay/bisexual men who cannot or don’t want to pass for straight) need to leave black or predominately black areas ASAP if they want to survive not to mention thrive.

    Expect homophobic abuse like that shown in the video to increase in and/or near “the hood” as time goes on. Many so-called straight black men with little or no education/training, long criminal records, no resources and no chance to improve their lives are filled with rage and hatred and they will take their sick frustrations out on whoever they think is an easy target. If you are a black gay man who cannot pass for straight, or don’t want to, don’t be a victim of some random straight black man’s (or straight black woman) rage.

    If you are a clockable and/or openly gay black man and you feel you have to live (shop, work, etc.) in a potentially dangerous area or environment learn what the law is in your state or jurisdiction regarding carrying a concealed firearm and act accordingly. If you have a firearm or are thinking about purchasing one, make sure you are always on the right side of the law in your state/jurisdiction.The choice is yours.

    PS: If you are a clockable or openly gay black man and you live in or near a typical black or predominately black area you are a target. The question is what are you going to do about it? The black gay man in the video could have been shot and killed by that thug.

  18. Rico
    Rico | July 17th, 2016
    0
    Comment Imported From Main Site

    Good article Ocky. I think the incident depicted in the above video shows very clearly what happens to clockable and/or openly gay black men on a daily/regular basis in typical black or predominately black areas (wastelands) otherwise known as "the hood". The only black gay/bisexual men who are "safe" in typical black or mostly black areas are those who are closeted and can pass for straight or those who are on the down-low. All others (those black gay/bisexual men who cannot or don't want to pass for straight) need to leave black or predominately black areas ASAP if they want to survive not to mention thrive. Expect homophobic abuse like that shown in the video to increase in and/or near "the hood" as time goes on. Many so-called straight black men with little or no education/training, long criminal records, no resources and no chance to improve their lives are filled with rage and hatred and they will take their sick frustrations out on whoever they think is an easy target. If you are a black gay man who cannot pass for straight, or don't want to, don't be a victim of some random straight black man's (or straight black woman) rage. If you are a clockable and/or openly gay black man and you feel you have to live (shop, work, etc.) in a potentially dangerous area or environment learn what the law is in your state or jurisdiction regarding carrying a concealed firearm and act accordingly. If you have a firearm or are thinking about purchasing one, make sure you are always on the right side of the law in your state/jurisdiction.The choice is yours. PS: If you are a clockable or openly gay black man and you live in or near a typical black or predominately black area you are a target. The question is what are you going to do about it? The black gay man in the video could have been shot and killed by that thug.

    I would never tell "clockable" men to go defenseless or to not buy a gun if they feel that's necessary for their safety. But at what point do fem and "clockable" men get to live and just be themselves without having to hide, arm up, or fake their personas? At what point do the rest of society get to live without the business end of toxic male's (black or white) weapon pointed at us? A lot of people won't speak up against these fools like this video fool out of some misguided sense of "black unity" or some hotep-culture/twisted religious belief that fem dudes "deserve it" or "have it coming to them". Those that co-sign on this fool's behavior need to remember these homophobic, nihilistic armed clowns might be pointing guns at fem dudes today, they'll turn their arms on anyone and everyone else tomorrow.

  19. Dreamwalker
    Dreamwalker | July 18th, 2016
    0
  20. Tyroc
    Tyroc | July 18th, 2016
    0
    Dreamwalker

    That's a plot twist I didn't see coming.

  21. JohnDoe
    JohnDoe | July 18th, 2016
    0
    Dreamwalker

    I didn't think he had a conscience.

  22. ControlledXaos
    ControlledXaos | July 18th, 2016
    0
    SwagJack

    …. they don't know if the dude they're about to bash is – like my older cuz – good with them hands or has a weapon.

    When I tell you that many men have suffered by the hands of a fem gay man that they underestimated. You don't want to come for a seasoned vet gay man because he's probably learned how throw hands.

  23. ControlledXaos
    ControlledXaos | July 18th, 2016
    0
    JohnDoe

    I didn't think he had a conscience.

    What was this? Video has been removed.

  24. elg | July 18th, 2016
    0

    I cannot read the perpetrator’s mind but I doubt he’s remorseful over what he did. This thug is likely trying to appeal to a judge who will be deciding his fate to give him a lighter sentence. That’s what this “apology” to the LGBTQ community is about.

    In the “apology” video I watched yesterday on another site, the perpetrator said (among other things) that he was especially remorseful because he “knew” the victim. In other words, he uttered a nasty anti-gay slur AND pulled a gun on a gay man he knew. Him knowing the gay man he assaulted makes the crime worse IMO. This thug knows he’s in big trouble. There’s no “he said, he said” to sift through because the video speaks for itself.

    Use your powers of discernment. Don’t take things at face value (not saying anyone on here did that). Learn to read between the lines and don’t go for the “okeydoke” (as they used to say).

  25. Dreamwalker
    Dreamwalker | July 18th, 2016
    +1
    ControlledXaos

    What was this? Video has been removed.

  26. JohnDoe
    JohnDoe | July 18th, 2016
    0
    Tyroc

    That's a plot twist I didn't see coming.

    The plot thickens…

  27. TreDaDon
    TreDaDon | July 24th, 2016
    0

    Ya know,

    Some of us in the LGBTQ community of people of color are really fractured. It can’t bother you that a fem gay is being “bashed” when your website has clickbait headlines every few days that always seem to imply that fem gays are the absolute most terrible thing put on the face of the earth ever. Those who hate gays see hardly any difference in a fem gay man and a masculine gay man. They see a gay man and they are filled with hatred and disgust. It’s very similar in my opinion to how racists can see a well educated, well dressed black man and have the same disdain they do for a “thug” in street clothes that they know nothing about. Until we start seeing each other as humans & respecting the diversity within, we can’t fight the hatred that’s outside. I used to have a problems with fems because I didn’t like the part of myself that was associated with being gay, anything less than a hypermasculine man. I let go of that a long time ago. I have friends of all ages, races, gender identities and they register on many different places on that scale of human gender.

    I understand this site was created to celebrate the masculine “normal” side of the life that is so often ignored by the mainstream & our own community (because sometimes the other side looks on the more masculine brothers as fakes, phonies or trying to fit in) but it needs to be about love. IMO.

  28. OckyDub
    Ockydub | July 24th, 2016
    0
    TreDaDon

    It can't bother you that a fem gay is being "bashed" when your website has clickbait headlines every few days that always seem to imply that fem gays are the absolute most terrible thing put on the face of the earth ever.

    Your overall reply was kinda long so that means you took time to type it. Can you devout the same amount of time and look on our main page and find the click bait headlines and subsequent articles that bash fem gays or portrays them as the most terrible thing put on earth?

    If you can't that means they don't exist and you're projecting and creating a false narrative.

    Many times fem gays (just like the white people you referenced in your message) think that anything that is not championing, promoting, catering to or pointing our double standards and hypocrisy in the Fem dominated LGBTQ community automatically means (and reads) anti-fem.

    Having compassion for humans doesn't mean we don't have differences, individual and group points of view. But back to your specific comment…again let me ask the questions:

    "find the click bait headlines and subsequent articles that bash fem gays or portrays them as the most terrible thing put on earth."

    [​IMG]

  29. Rico
    Rico | July 24th, 2016
    0
    Dreamwalker

    Is that DL fool still milking his 15 minutes of infamy?
    I tried watching, but then I was like "Bye, Fellatia!" Lol

  30. JohnDoe
    JohnDoe | July 25th, 2016
    0
    TreDaDon

    I used to have a problems with fems because I didn't like the part of myself that was associated with being gay, anything less than a hypermasculine man. I let go of that a long time ago.

    Can you please explain how you did this because it would help others dealing with this same issue. Both masc and fem dudes, mind you.

  31. SwagJack
    SwagJack | July 25th, 2016
    0
    TreDaDon

    Ya know, Some of us in the LGBTQ community of people of color are really fractured. It can't bother you that a fem gay is being "bashed" when your website has clickbait headlines every few days that always seem to imply that fem gays are the absolute most terrible thing put on the face of the earth ever.

    Wrong. They don't even post frequently enough for you to see anything "every few days." Plus I've never seen anything here that "bashes" fem dudes. I'm pretty sure that would have been called out.

    TreDaDon

    Those who hate gays see hardly any difference in a fem gay man and a masculine gay man. They see a gay man and they are filled with hatred and disgust. It's very similar in my opinion to how racists can see a well educated, well dressed black man and have the same disdain they do for a "thug" in street clothes that they know nothing about.

    Bad parallel. You're overlooking what's considered masculine privilege. Those who hate gays don't always "see" gays. There's no monolith personality trait or hyper gaydar that enables folks to see "gayness." The logic you're proposing is just as faulty as the Black lives matter vs Blue lives matter argument. You might not be able to discern my sexuality by looking at or observing me, but I can't hide the fact that I'm Black.

  32. JohnDoe
    JohnDoe | July 25th, 2016
    0
    SwagJack

    Bad parallel. You're overlooking what's considered masculine privilege. Those who hate gays don't always "see" gays. There's no monolith personality trait or hyper gaydar that enables folks to see "gayness." The logic you're proposing is just as faulty as the Black lives matter vs Blue lives matter argument. You might not be able to discern my sexuality by looking at or observing me, but I can't hide the fact that I'm Black.

    Except maybe naturally effeminate guys.

  33. ColumbusGuy
    ColumbusGuy | July 25th, 2016
    0
    TreDaDon

    Ya know, Some of us in the LGBTQ community of people of color are really fractured. It can't bother you that a fem gay is being "bashed" when your website has clickbait headlines every few days that always seem to imply that fem gays are the absolute most terrible thing put on the face of the earth ever. Those who hate gays see hardly any difference in a fem gay man and a masculine gay man. They see a gay man and they are filled with hatred and disgust. It's very similar in my opinion to how racists can see a well educated, well dressed black man and have the same disdain they do for a "thug" in street clothes that they know nothing about. Until we start seeing each other as humans & respecting the diversity within, we can't fight the hatred that's outside. I used to have a problems with fems because I didn't like the part of myself that was associated with being gay, anything less than a hypermasculine man. I let go of that a long time ago. I have friends of all ages, races, gender identities and they register on many different places on that scale of human gender. I understand this site was created to celebrate the masculine "normal" side of the life that is so often ignored by the mainstream & our own community (because sometimes the other side looks on the more masculine brothers as fakes, phonies or trying to fit in) but it needs to be about love. IMO.

    It is interesting that you posted this in a thread that is pretty much the exact opposite of the 'clickbait' you refer to. I have lately seen several articles just like this one-that are basically concerned about what happens to black gay men or in fact, any black man who is perceived as gay-which would pretty much be about all femme gays, right? And just because you had a problem with femme gay men because of you own negative issues, does not mean that all masc gay men have the same issues.

    Also what I have picked up is that the problems people here tend to have with femme gay black men is not that they are necessarily femme, it is the negative behaviors that seems to go along with femme gay men(a broad generalization of course) and the official 'viewpoint' of black gay men, the narrative of black gay men, being determined by femme black gay men.

    *In most critiques by members and the founders of the site, any 'femme' stuff is often accompanied by criticism of the stereotypical 'rachet' talk or behavior. In the post on the gay men with Jacob Kohinoor where the men are talking about masculine men, the one who got the most criticism by far was the blonde one with the nasty attitude, even though others were just as femme if not more so. Even when Nick does his 'gay voice', it is usually in the context of the person exhibiting negative things..'reading to filth, dragging, hunty, miss Thang, etc.'…which is related to how these behaviors being expressed by 'some' femme men are the leading view of how some of the world sees black gay men.

    It is actually about 'broadening' the scope of how black gay men are seen and is actually about including different types of men other than just femme men-who dominate the narrative. Every now and then yeah, something is said that crosses over a bit into unfair criticism/joking IMO, but nobody is perfect and I do not see that as a persistent theme here.

  34. OckyDub
    Ockydub | July 25th, 2016
    0
    ColumbusGuy

    …the official 'viewpoint' of black gay men, the narrative of black gay men, being determined by femme black gay men.

    [​IMG]

  35. elg | August 2nd, 2016
    0

    “the problems people here tend to have with femme gay black men is not that they are necessarily femme, it is the negative behaviors that seems to go along with femme gay men(a broad generalization of course) and the official ‘viewpoint’ of black gay men, the narrative of black gay men, being determined by femme black gay men.”

    Ocky, you appeared to strongly co-sign that sentence especially the last part. Since you have such a big problem with femme gay black men determining the official viewpoint (narrative) of black gay men, you should put your own “narrative” (whatever it is) out there. But in order to do that, effectively, you have to “come out”.

    I understand that you are about 40 years old and if you haven’t come out by 40, you probably never will. I just don’t think you can change this so-called narrative you’re so dissatisfied with without coming out and putting your own “truth” out there.

    There are black gay men of all kinds on You Tube, for example, telling their stories/truths (like Walter Hampton, a masculine “out” black gay man). Ocky, you could be one of them but you choose not to be. My guess is that if you become frustrated enough with the status quo regarding the narrative for black gay men, as you see it, you’ll make a move.

    PS: Femme or “clockable” gay black men, like the black gay man who was viciously slurred and had a gun pointed at him in the video, are the VICTIMS of homophobic abuse all the time in black or predominately black hellholes. What we all saw in the video is the daily reality for femme gay black gay men. Let’s keep that front and center in this conversation.

  36. Jeweld | September 12th, 2016
    0

    The greatest unfortunate thing in all of this is the “masculine” gay men putting themselves on a pedestal as if the fem gay man is responsible for the gun being pulled on him. If it wasn’t for HIM… WE would not exist outside of our deep, dark closets of shame and insecurity. Collectively, as a black gay community, out gay men have the greatest self esteem and confidence. They are not BELOW the “masculine” descriptive they are ABOVE it as demonstrated in this video. They are the BRAVE ones not the cowards who hide behind the belief that if you are masculine you are safe. Trust me, that crippled man would have pulled the same gun on a masculine gay man once he found out he was gay but what’s MORE important is he would have NEVER pulled it on a white gay man. We have NO regard or respect for each other’s lives as black men. You have a man here who is handicapped hating on an out gay man. What symbolism. It is no wonder that SO many of us in the black gay male community are alone, we collectively hate ourselves so got damn much. Live and let live and stop chasing what eludes you. The hunt for a disturbed self-hating DL masculine thug speaks volumes for deeply challenged self-value. Why not just date the guys who beat the shit out of you in grade school? Perhaps that’s the sum of our value and that’s really what we are looking for anyway. Someone to continue to make us feel worthless. Wake the fuck up black brothers.




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