President Trump

Discussion in 'Race, Religion, Science and Politics' started by OckyDub, May 22, 2016.

  1. OckyDub

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    DonaldTrumpOvalOffice-647x434.jpg
    This country is saturated with hate, ignorance and religious fanaticism, which is polar opposite of sound logic. Can we just acknowledge Trump is going be president and use this time to wisely come up with contingency plans?

    For example: Day 1 of Obama’s presidency, repubs drew a line in the sand and stated they will oppose him at every turn and make him a one term president. Can Dems and those Repubs who oppose Trump draw a similar line? Or will these bought and paid for Dems just roll over and continue to collect their under table payments from lobbyist, corporations and banks?
     
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  2. ColumbusGuy

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    NOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!! I REFUSE to accept this heresy of a thread! (I do agree with the first sentence though).

    NO
    NO
    NO
    NO
    NO 1425_3.jpg
     
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  3. Winston Smith

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    It's too early in the cycle to concede anything. Come back I'm September, we'll have a better psychological and statistical data on what likely voters will commit.

    I'm not worried about Trump. No president gets everything he wants, even though Trump thinks he will.

    I don't listen to silly as people who say, "If Trump wins I'm leaving." First of all, these people are full of shid, they know damn well they ain't goin' nowhere. Second, as Curtis Mayfield sang, "this is MY country."

    There's nothing new under the sun. If you really want to understand Trump and Sanders followers I recommend reading "The True Believer" by Eric Hoffer. Hoffer accurately showed how certain kinds of people will glom onto anything because they have a need to attain nearness close to anything they see as being better or more powerful than themselves. That's why certain people go from one mass movement to another; e.g. Baby boomers that were extreme hippies and yippies in the 60s only to become extreme Reaganites in the 80s. And as with all mass movements, Trump will fail spectacularly and the people who kiss his azz today will want to lynch it tomorrow.

    Trump and Sanders followers aka Mad Crowd Disease....
     
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  4. ColumbusGuy

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    Ocky is a Sanders supporter and detests Killary/Shillary/Billary/Shrillary/etc. with a white hot intensity. I just hope if Hillary gets the nom(as she likely will) that the Sanders people won't just sit home and cut off their nose to spite their face and let the Antichrist Trump be prez. It will be a sign of Sanders' true character to see if he rallies his supporters around the nominee if it is not him-for the greater good.
     
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  5. OckyDub

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    Bernie Sanders and Sanders supporters will not cost Hillary her anointing. Hillary Clinton's baggage of lies and deceit will cost her the election. The responsibility lies at her hooven feet.
     
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  6. Winston Smith

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    Gasp! I finally disagree with Doc Ock on something! I probably dislike Clinton as much as him, but I am not feeling Sanders. Don't get me wrong, he seems sincere and all, but what experience does he have in serious administration? His whole schtick is "I'm not her." I have a problem with his followers as many of them seem as emotionally and factually unhinged as a Trump people. Neither Trump or Sanders can even remotely deliver on a fraction of the nationalist/socialist promises they serve up. Although I have some Ock-like apprehensions regarding attacks on black masculinity a la his Wade Davis article, should Clinton get in.

    In light of that, I'll check out any Sanders comments here as it'd be nice to read an intelligent Sanders position, rather than the usual millennial diffuse thoughts.
     
  7. ColumbusGuy

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    when it comes to politics Nick is the sensible one...but he is missing in action. And Ocky(LMAO) will not support the ' hooved one' as he put it. I understand why but he should still hold his nose and vote for the old hag.
     
  8. Winston Smith

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    Well, at least we both agree she ain't the hope or change.

    NO SHE CAN'T

    Hooven feet? Lol, nah she's just retaining water in that Prada, bruh.

    Besides, don't defame Hooven feet. Pan was a sexy little mofo

    [​IMG]
     
  9. OckyDub

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    I'm mad I didn't think of "hooven, hooved" feet earlier.

    OMG I can't stop laughing. She walks out on stage like:
    [​IMG]
     
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  10. ColumbusGuy

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    You might as well go all the way and call her 'cloven hooved' lol. She WILL get the nomination because she knows the way and all she has to do is keep putting one cloven hoof in front of the other and she will get there! lol
     
  11. OckyDub

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    If Dems haven't learned or understood in the last couple of months then they never will; Trump can say and do no wrong. Every time he does or says something fuked up or stupid, his support increases. This man has the Midas touch.

    Yall should be spending 50% of your time supporting Hillary De Vil and the other 50% coming up with contingency plans for Trump.
     
  12. Winston Smith

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    Once you see it, you can't unsee it...man, you gonna get get me in trouble with all these white corporate female Hillary stans in my office! As if being the lone, outspoken black male wasn't bad enough. Now every time someone says "Hillary" I'll have a Machurian Candidate response see these feet and burst out laughing.
     
  13. Winston Smith

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  14. alton

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    I love how Kim Jon Un called him on his BS and basically said his attempt at a meeting with N. Korea was pure self serving propaganda bullshit. LMAO When North Korea can see through your bullshit, it's time to have several seats.
    [​IMG]
     
  15. NikR

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    The contingency plan is to vote for the bad candidate to keep out the worse candidate.

    Or we could just throw our arms up to the heavens and feebly say things like, "can we just acknowledge Trump is going be president". We can be solution-oriented or drown in despair. For the record, drowning in despair is a valid choice. It's a choice made by people every day. I have a patient with a curable cancer who won't call the surgeon--so it'll spread and he'll die. He understands that by 'not making a choice' he actually IS making a choice. I've told him this. I'll go to the funeral to remind myself that poor decisions are made everyday, and even I can't help people make better decisions all the time.

    Don't make a contingency plan for Jan 2017, make it for Nov 2016. Or don't.
     
    #15 NikR, May 28, 2016
    Last edited: May 28, 2016
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  16. ColumbusGuy

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    Finally some sanity when it comes to politics in here. Amen! I am going to do whatever I can to help keep Ohio out of Trump's dirty, greedy, slimy, corrupt gonna-stack-SCOTUS-with-conservative-probusiness-antigay-fukups/get-us-in-a-war/make-us-even-more-hated-in-the-World hands
     
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  17. Winston Smith

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    And what's wrong with being pro-business? Every business in America is not some international conglomerate dumping dangerous chemicals into some urban backyard. Plus liberals tend to be selective about corporate indignation. I believe Hillary supporters use iPhones. Who the hell do they think makes their cute, bougie digital accrouments? Little, well-paid, Chinese fairies and pixies that magically manufacture them with FMLA and generous health benefits? Nawww, its an international, tax-dodging, carcinogenic-manufacturing-materials conglomerate run by a gay man (because, you know all us gay people are as morally as pure as the driven snow).

    I support numerous independent businesses, and definitely loved the entrepreneurial spirit of black folk in Nick and Ock's town the many times I was there in the 90s. So, like my hero Booker T. Washington, I am very pro-business and science and industrial edication, especially for the minority, woman and LGBT entrepreneurs. Not every black man, even black gay man, carries the water for Hillary, Rahm, et al. And no offense, every adjective you just used for Trump, describes Clinton and the Democrats:
    -Dirty? Check.
    -Greedy? Check (**Clinton Foundation**cough**donors**questionable philanthropy compared to Gates Foundation**cough cough)
    -Slimy? Check.
    -Conservative? Check (hey, look y'all, I'm a college educated black male super-pedator, better strap me in an electric chair like Ricky Ray Rector; or set up a sentencing structure that decimates a whole generation of Gen-X and millenial black males! Who-hoo, "New Democrats"!)
    -SCOTUS (Hmmm...who supported that New London CT eminent domain decision? The one that says private property can be confiscated for corporate interests, not public works as understood for two hundred years of American jurisprudence? Was it just the conservative ones? Is that Breyer and Ginsburg over there?)
    -Anti-Gay fuk-ups (Bill Clinton Defense of Marriage Act anyone?)
    -Get us in wars (Clinton era misadventures and no fly zones which laid the basis fir further Dubya misadventures, and didn't a certain NY Senator vote for said Dubya misadventures; remember Madeleine Not-bright telling Colin Powell what's the use of having an U.S. army if you can't use it?)
    -Make us even more hated in the world? Obama has (rightfully in many cases) given world leaders more bows and apologies than anyone from Washington and people will still have whatever opinion they have of us. And having been overseas (sadly, only in a military capacity), I found the foreigners are intelligent enough to know how to separate our stupid policies from our stupid people (i.e. Hillary and The Donald). Besides, there's a global economy out there that will do well with or WITHOUT America, so while they may bristle at Trump, the other five billion people will do just fine without us. No one needs a Marshall Plan from us anymore. Americans, both Trump and Hillary-bound, think America is the Ptolemaic center of the world's universe. It ain't.

    As for Hillary type politicos, I live in a city, like Detroit, that was run into the ground by Democrats. The hell, segregation and terror that black folks found themselves in for the last 100 years in Chicago was architected and designed by Democrats. Like the Soviet Union and Cuba, this is and has been for most of the 20th and 21st Centuries, a one-party town. As for the supposed anti-gay wave that Trump would issue, I'll agree somewhat with Ock in one of the podcasts that race issues for me as a gay black man trumps many gay bourgeosie concerns like marriage. And some of the most racist shit I've ever heard in this city has come out of the mouths of Hillary supporting gay white males who clutch their pearls at the large number of black and gay LGBT homeless youth who come to the gay part of town only to be ostracized and shunned as much by the genteel gays as they were by their churchie black and Latino families and neighborhoods.

    All that to say, just because some of us hate Hillary as much as Trump, doesn't mean we haven't thought abou the issues. In the words of one of my favorite Michael Stipe (a gay!) songs,

    "Withdrawal in disgust is not the same as apathy."

    Now, if you'll excuse me, I' obviously cranky and just woke up. I'm about to take my pro-business azz down to the sole proprietor owned coffee shop in my neighborhood and don't care at the moment if my macchiato is fair trade sourced or not.
     
  18. ColumbusGuy

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    ^^ too much to digest right now but anyway.... the pro-business in the sense that conservatives tend to be pro-business, and conservatives are more likely to be socially conservative as well(not always) and these were just large generalizations. And when I speak of business I speak of the large corporations that are feeding the two percent and are ready to take us back to Feudalism- I just took it for granted that was understood. I support independent small businesses (the anti-Walmarts) too. Sorry for the misunderstanding.

    Also I did not recall saying that any of the other things did not apply to any particular Democrat or Democrats in general, thank you very much lol.

    I also never said 'pro-business' was necessarily a bad thing-I linked it to Trump and with Scotus, because I think if there is one thing we know about Trump it is that being a businessman, he is going to be pro-business(and all that stuff about jobs for the working class whites who support him is bull-he does not give a damn about them). But there are pro-business country club conservatives and pro-business bible thumpers. If we get Trump, we could luck out and get some pro-business justices who are not too terribly socially conservative-actually we don't know what we will get if we get him because he is a nut and who knows which way he will turn. But if you really think conservatives give more of a shit about blacks than more liberal(not necessarily Democrats) people, you have my sympathy.

    I also never said gay men were pure. Certainly not white ones, and certainly not black ones (see BGC).
    :scust:


    There are over seven billion other people in the World, not five. Only two billion off. :) :sass2:

    'large number of black and gay LGBT homeless youth'...they would not need to go to gay whites if they were not turned away by their own black families and people-you know, the same ones who supported those get tough Clinton crime bills back in the day, the same ones who have voted for Democrats over and over and over.

    And we still do matter in the World, what with our military and our still having the highest GDP ( generally about 18 trillion compared to about 12 trillion for China) So I would hardly say we are completely irrelevant. And nobody or no thing from a single person to a single nation is indispensable. That is basic common knowledge, I would think.

    *Oh and spell check might be a good thing- black male super-pedator is not a good look. :troll:I could not resist. sorry. lol

    Regarding the rest of the World and their opinion of Trump vs Hillary, Guess we can agree to disagree.

    And if your race issues trump (no pun intended) gay issues, then don't be surprised when many white gay men(sadly) are not your ally. I am. I think both gay issues and issues regarding racism are both important and are not mutually exclusive. And I agree there is terrible racism in the white gay community, I am not a fan of the Gay Elite that controls the narrative of white gay men(just like this site is not a fan of those who control the narrative of the black gay men) and overall white gay men have failed black(and other minority) men terribly. I will not dispute that. It seems that black gay men are in a very difficult position when it comes to having allies, again very sadly. So are those young black homeless gay youth able to turn to you, another black gay man? Are you visible to them, available to them? you know, one of your own? How many men on here are? Maybe that is why they turn to the effeminate black gays-they are visible at least.


    Hope you enjoyed your macchiato.
     
  19. Winston Smith

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    Yep, sho' did!! Now I don't even need the spellcheck on my phone!

    With a li'l java, I'm feeling all turtle-necked and peace-like. So my response to you is:

    [​IMG]

    I still stand by the R.E.M. lyric, though. The way I feel about all politicians and voters is best summed up by H.L. Mencken:

    "Democracy is the theory that the common people know what they want, and deserve to get it good and hard."
     
  20. ColumbusGuy

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    ^^In a good enough mood to answer the questions in that last paragraph? Sorry, my allergies are bothering me, and the flowers? Well that was a nice thought but I also don't believe in plantism and the fact that those flowers were not picked for food( and were probably dosed with harmful pesticides in Columbia or somewhere) does not sit well with me so, thanks but no thanks. *removes very gayish flower from gun barrel and hands it back(they look like some kind of daisy or carnation-not my faves anyway)*
     
  21. Winston Smith

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    Oh so you want to be all John Foster Dulles today and not accept my John Kerryish acquiescence? Cool, I take my flowers and Jefferson Airplane LPs back. Lol. How do know that wasn't locally sourced parsley or arugula being placed in the business end of that M16A? I used to eat MREs and rations myself in the field and they could stand some garnishing.

    Now, as for your last paragraph: obviously everyone on this board or site has lives that are more expansive and involved than can be gleamed from reading a single person's commentary. That being said, I know plenty of individual black gay social workers, doctors, professionals, etc. here that individually do what they can. I don't know what you mean by visible. Should they be all suit and tied on a float at the pride parade? ("We're here, we're Grad Degreed and queer, get used to it!")

    Working with mainstream (re upper middle class white male dominated) gay organizations is not an option (I've tried as have they) as these groups and centers talk a lot of phony, liberal, DNC diversity bullshit but don't practice it; or really want the input of said diverse communities (they will, however, gladly take our financial contributions as long as we shut up and go along for the ride). I really don't see where effeminate v masculine plays into what you're stating. Homelessness for lgbt youth isn't really a masc v fem issue. Its a race and class issue. Believe me, the middle class fems are the worst as they see these homeless youth as declasse and interferring with their snap-queen social fun and climbing. I give props to working class fems who form "families" here to look out for the youth and one another:
    …The Carters… Redefining The Families Of Chicago…

    So, black and Latino homeless lgbt youth in Chicago migrate to the gay/Lakeview area here (known as boystown) only to find that they are just as rejected by the mainstream gay community. Tell me, how would said gay youth fair any WORSE under Trump when they really don't have it any better under the Hell-ary Democrats who own and run this town? Reality for them is not going to change regardless as to who is in the White House. Sure things might get a little uncomfortable for the well-heeled gays under a Trump, but not much. After all, it was George W. Bush's solicitor general that defended gay marriage before SCOTUS while Democrats like Clinton and Obama were busy "evolving" on the issue (re waffling and pandering to the homophobic black bougie church voter). At least Trump Tower here might give some entry-level jobs to said homeless youth which is more than can be said for Secretary Pantsuits and her mega-corporate court jester, Mayor Tiny Dancer.

    In the end, SO WHAT if Ock or every Sanders supporter sits at home and doesn't vote for or support Hillary? Was there REALLY going to be that much of a goddamned difference for the homeless and underclass (gay or straight) under Hillary than Trump?
    Seats on the 2016 Democratic Platform Committee Are NOT a "Political Revolution" | Black Agenda Report

    F--- CLINTON:fredo:
    I need another espresso....
     
    #21 Winston Smith, May 29, 2016
    Last edited: May 29, 2016
  22. ColumbusGuy

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    ^^I don't even think you are real. Funny how certain long term members vanish, and poof! Here you come!

    If you are real, and those sentiments are true, then congratulations! as a gay black man you, not Hillary, are gonna be fucked. S
    :yeshrug:

    You missed this: "So are those young black homeless gay youth able to turn to you, another black gay man? Are you visible to them, available to them? you know, one of your own?" -ya know, this was the main question in that last paragraph...and completely unanswered.
    :ravetho:

    you managed to say a lot and not really answer anything.
     
    #22 ColumbusGuy, May 29, 2016
    Last edited: May 29, 2016
  23. Winston Smith

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    :lawd:
    Nope, I'm real. I can't speak for other posters...maybe people get busy and live their lives? As for the 50% (supposed) HIV rate, I'm not sure what that has to do with Clinton, Trump or Sanders, other than availability of medical services? And often, services funding is just as much a state budgetary issue as Federal (as social service agencies in Illinois have learned).

    Dude, it is NOT that serious, this is folk shooting the sh*t on a discussion board; but oh well, I'm on ignore, lol. Just because a person doesn't vote for or support the candidate of your choice doesn't mean they aren't "doing anything." For example, I know a white, evangelical, Republican family; John Kasich types. Yet, they are some of the most hardcore environmentalists I know and stan hard for environmental issues more than most so-called liberals and Democrats. Don't extrapolate what people may or may not be doing in real life based on comments on a board; a person might be involved in all kinds of places or organizations outside of the Internet and social media.
     
  24. ColumbusGuy

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    LOL. I can't keep anyone on ignore. I like political quarreling I have to admit. I did take it too far though this last post. And you still did not answer the question but that is ok. It went from political in that last paragraph-got off track-there was nothing political there. Anyway, I'm gonna give myself a break and blame this cold medicine and lurking on (of all places) BGC before I got on here for my not so friendly state of mind as I got off topic.

    *extends olive branch*

    *Yeah I edited the most embarrassing parts out of that post. Not exactly one of my shining moments, these last few posts. A reminder that I am as everyone still even at my age a work in progress.
     
    #24 ColumbusGuy, May 29, 2016
    Last edited: May 29, 2016
  25. Winston Smith

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    Dude, you're cool. I guess my problem is that I used to watch Firing Line as a kid and I loved debate club a little too much. As Langston Hughes said about Wallace Thurman, I've got a critical mind that can find something wrong with everything lol. Just understand that, ultimately, my mentality is that I'm going to live and survive regardless as to who is in office. The funny thing is that, while you probably thought I was poring through Ken Starr's old files this morning between our postings, I was actually designing an anti-Trump t-shirt for my (future) Zazzle store. Although our discussion gave me another idea for a shirt that pretty much sums up my feelings on all politics:

    "Don't blame me, I voted for that OTHER idiot!"
    :franko1:
     
  26. ColumbusGuy

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    Yeah I was not in the right mindset for this today. I apologize for some of what I posted. This has not been the best holiday. I get insulted by family, and then go right over there to clear it up, and get insulted even worse. I just kept it in and left. And came back and made than insulting post on here. *sigh* Funny how nobody can hurt you like the people you are closest too. Never-the-less coming on here and releasing that in a post in a political section on a messageboard was a bitch move-as was the blocking bullshit-also a bitch move. I guess I am part bitch and have more in common with the 'Gay Elite' than I might want to know.

    Thanks for being the better person and taking the peace offering.

    * I like the back and forth too...remember well 'Point/Counterpoint'(are you old enough to remember that?) and the SNL parody with the "Jane you ignorant slut'? - just need to be careful about my state of mind- I am a Cancer and we are moody af.
     
  27. Winston Smith

    Best Site Comments The 1000 Daps Club Supporter

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    You see my avatar? I chose that because a) I'm a fan of Walt Kelly and Pogo, but b) that expression on the tiger's face as he leans over the typewriter is EXACTLY how I end up looking most days due to family and co-workers (Kelly was a genius for capturing expressions). That, and I drink before I go to work these days. Long as your not visibly inebriated, whose to know?

    I'm a skeptic and atheist, but supposedly I'm a Virgo. I have to admit, at least for me, this sh*t below is ON--THE--MONEY:
    Virgo man

    I especially like this part: "Later in life he's likely to look much younger than he really is. Call it unfair but this is a sign which usually ages very well. One factor in this is that Virgo men are more likely than most to monitor what they eat and drink, how frequently they exercise, and generally to prefer a healthy lifestyle." Or, as an older gay doctor friend of mine (who I highly suspect was go-go boy and escort in his youth) says, I look like someone who hasn't had a lot of chemicals in his body.
     
  28. ColumbusGuy

    The 100 Daps Club

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    Virgos are cool-my partner was a Virgo. I again apologize about my insensitivity in this thread, particularly given what you seem to be going through with work and family(drinking before work is not good). I also want to say I think it was admirable that you let your coworkers and doctor in on things-even if the results were not so great. That is a difficult thing to do, especially when you do not get very good results-hopefully though things will work out for the best in the long run.

    * I used to look good/younger for my age too-used to! I am told that I still do, but nah, not really. I have not only cracked(as my kind tends to do as they age) but damn near shattered. lol. Bad living does not pay off in the end.
     
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  29. Winston Smith

    Best Site Comments The 1000 Daps Club Supporter

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    Once again, you're cool. That's the thing about Internet comm, it brings people from great distances together quickly and cheaply, but text-based messages flatten nuance, inflection...all the things that spoken or in person comm can reflect.

    I just thought the horoscope thing was funny. I absolutely don't believe in them but that particularly web page had me down to a 't'.

    As for the doctor, well they always say men, and black men especially, don't tell doctors everything. Here I go and open up to him and he freaked out. No biggie, I just went and found another. The co-workers wasn't a formal announcement. I told one co-worker because it turned out HE was gay and everybody else knew but me (so much for gaydar). So I told him (knowing the church wags were eavesdropping) and I just let the office grapevine do its thing.
     
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  30. ColumbusGuy

    The 100 Daps Club

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    ^^ You tell anyone something like that (especially another 'ghey') in an office setting and it pretty much is a guaranteed announcement-you might as well have screamed it from a belltower lol. They will get over it eventually and have some other petty shit to distract them for the most part hopefully.
     
  31. Winston Smith

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    Oh believe me, I knew EXACTLY what I was doing. I studied B F Skinner very well....
     
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